Yeah, I know that everyone ever been in lockup is "innocent"... but in my case, this ain't no shit...

as a precursor, I should mention I've never so mu ch aas been threatened with jail. I was a goody-two-shoes kid, and never gave my parents more trouble than not doing my homework.

Worse thing I ever did, in the State's mind, was bounce a check (I was on DoD business, out of the country, at the time, and my paycheck bounced. As soon as I got back home, I took care of that.)

Had a few speeding tickets in my younger days, to the point that at 23 years of age I had 2 of 12 points left on my license. Realized the gravity of the situ, and straightened my ass, and slowed it, out....

So-

I got a ticket in January of 08. 41 in a 32, in foggie conditions, on the bike. I was honestly so preoccupied/terrified of traffic in the fog that I forgot the speed limit in my daily commute.

Guilty, I have no problem admitting. But it's stupid (in this state, at least) not to go to court and plead guilty, as you'll automatically get about 1/2 the fee/violation. Judges are lenient unless you're brazen, which I am not.

My schedule being what it is (my hours change about every 5 days, between 0600-1400, 1400-2200, 2200-0600, 0900-1700, 0600-1800, and 1800-0600 depending on the day/weekend/etc- it's a 24/7 shop and has extremely wierd hours, and I'm the "go-to guy"), I fucked up and forgot the court date was 12MAR08 and thought it was 21MAR08.

Yes, I fucked up. I admit and own that.

Got a letter from the state on 24MAR08. "You've been tried in absentia on 12MAR08, and found guilty. You owe us $120 by 31MARo08, or your license will be suspended".

IMMEDIATELY jumped on the bike, headed to the courthouse, paid $120 in cash, and got a receipt. Verified I had nothing else to do, I'd paid my obligation to the state. No need to worry about suspension of license, as it only applies if you pay AFTER 31MAR08. Which I'd paid a week before that date.

Flash forward to last Monday. I get pulled by a cop. In process of running my license, he finds my license is suspended, for failure to pay a ticket. Which I'd paid on time- see above. This is the first violation I've received in 10 years (since I've been married).

Eh, WTF? I explain I've paid, but as the computer says my licenzse is suspended, I "am going downtown".

I have never so much as been threatened with handcuffs in a non-sexual situ, let alone imprisonment, the back of a police car, etc.

All of which I experienced this day.

I was held from approx 1500 Monday to 1500 Tuesday, last week. Went to bond court, was released on my own recognizance, and am out on bail.
Went immediately last Tuesday to the DMV and found that, even though I had a receipt showing the ticket as paid one week BEFORE deadline, my license has been suspended. WTF-ever, paid $100 to reinstate my license. Went to the courthouse, paid $25 to get paperwork releasing my bike. Went to tow shop, paid $300 to release my bike from them (cocksuckers!!).

Still have a $670 ticket that requires me attend court on 17JUL08 to have it judged. Bear in mind, my license should not have been suspended. Also, I've already lost 2 days at work, and the humiliation of being dragged through the system (drug dealers, one guy had been pulled off his wife's corpse in a domestic, assault on officers, and similar charges were my companions those 24 hours). Not to mention the stress on my career and family.

To make things more interesting, I have a clearance for my job. It requires I report this sort of thing to my security officer. How's that gonna look?

I am seriously considering getting the 17th July behind me, and then sueing the city. I am not one to bring frivolous lawsuits- I've never sued anyone. But I think that, as a law-abiding citizen that was falsely accused/arrested/jailed, it is something that bears consideration.

also, and I'm not sure of the requirements here- but I was never Mirandized.

I believe I can answer this the best out of everyone else on here. So, please allow me.

As far as your Miranda rights, we don't have to give them to you unless we are questioning you about the crime specifically. All that crap on TV about a person gets the cuffs slapped on him and is being walked to the car is just that... crap. So, unless it's a crime where an investigation is required or, we don't have enough evidence, then we will Mirandize you and then ask you questions about the crime. Whereas you then have the right to invoke your 5th Amendment right and remain silent. Seeing as how you got pulled over for a simple V&TL violation, no Miranda was necessary at that time.

As far as suing the city. No go on that anyway. You paid the ticket on a "Friday" and the DMV computers takes a while to 'clear' your suspension in the computer. Cops have no control over that. If you got a letter saying that you were 'convicted' of the crime because you failed to show, that is an automatic suspension of your DLIC(here in NY anyway). It's pretty early in the morning at the moment and you rambled out so many dates and times I can't clearly "see" the picture you are trying to paint with when you went to the court and when you paid the fine, etc..etc... Basically, if you got a letter saying you were 'convicted' regardless of whether or not you paid the fine, you are still convicted of the 'no show'. That 'no show' takes precedence over the V&TL infraction. So, in essence, you, at the time had two convictions. One was for the original infraction and the other was for the 'no show'. Both of them were automatically assigned to your DLIC because you did not show for the court date.

When you got pulled over did you produce the receipt for your payment of the fine? Our court clerks instruct all offenders (well when I was doing 'regular cop work') to produce the receipt because the system might take weeks to clear out your suspension. It kind of sucks but you can thank data entry folks that get minimum wage who care nothing about whether or not your suspension gets cleared up in time. Many times in the past I have pulled people over with suspended DLIC and hear the old "I just paid that!" line. No go. I am bound as to what the computer tells me...not what the person behind the vehicle is saying. I have to assume that the computer is right and you are lying. There is case law on that sort of thing and the Police / City / Municipality is indemnified from any sort of lawsuit that comes upon them provided that the Officer was acting in good judgment and the information he had "at hand" (the computer reporting you as suspended).

That's why I tell people to NEVER use Geico as the car insurance. You are late on a payment by one day and those Corporate punks send out a electronic notice to your State's DMV to suspend your vehicle for not having any insurance. I've arrested many people that had Geico as their car insurance company! Bad bad company for Insurance. Everyone makes mistakes, they don't care if you are a day late or a dollar short.

As far as your impound fees, you might have recourse with that. Check with the town. They may have an arrangement with the Impound Company that requires them to charge no more then "X-Y-Z" for a car impound/motorcyle impound what-not. If they don't...then the Tow company can charge you whatever they want.

Hopefully I answered your questions.

Wow BK, your getting screwed by the man. Sorry to hear it bro.

Thanks for the Miranda info. You're right, I was going by what I've seen on TV. No, I don't think that it's the great be-all in terms of accuracy (far from it!), but I have no experience with that sort of thing, personally.

Re: paying the ticket. I paid on the 24th of March. A Monday. The fee was due by the following Monday. I paid cash, at the cashier's office at the Courthouse. It can't possibly get in the system faster than that. In this state, if you fail to show, there is no bench warrant issued or similar, you have 15 days to pay the fee. It is NOT an automatic suspension in this state. There is no additional charge, either.

Re: carrying the receipt- I always carry it for a month. You'll note that this occurred 3 months ago. Ironically, I had taken the receipt out of my backpack the previous weekend. Precisely how long is one to carry their documentation? Should I carry every receipt for registration, renewal, fees, etc, forever? There are computers involved, I expect things to be taken care of in a timely manner. This means if you give me a deadline to pay by, and I meet it, I darn well better not experience the result of failing to meet the deadline.

Regarding "good luck fighting this": Thanks. I know of several folks in the state that have had almost the identical experience (only varying in the dates involved), that have sued and won.

Don't get me wrong: I'm not a litigious sort. But darn if I'm going to just take this, either.

Best of luck, bk. And sorry for your troubles.

Good luck ... if you end in court, it should be all suspended---sometimes, the court clerk, at the court house can arbitrarily handle these sort of issues .... hope, it works out for you.

Here in NY, you are required/expected/told to carry the receipt for about 30 days. That is how long it takes, worse case scenario to have the system 'purged' of your suspension. So, was the original infraction 3 months ago or, was it 3 months later after you had paid to get the ticket/suspension lifted?



If you know people that sued for this same thing and won, the state would have changed the practices on how they deal with this sort of thing in order to not get sued anymore. You think the state likes giving away their hard-earned-stolen-money?? LoL I think those other people had almost similar situation but not exactly the same as yours. I can't fathom the state getting sued and just going "Oh well, the next person that comes along won't have any idea we are wrong and we can get away with it again!' That doesn't make sense to me. I am by no means sticking up for your state, or it's practices. But if I got sued for doing something wrong, I would make sure I did not do that same thing over again to open me up to another lawsuit.

First of sorry to hear about this and it's a lot easier to give advice when your not involved, but I would try to seek advice from the people that deal with this on a regular basis, ie clerk, officers. Then maybe there is an easier solution. Of course when you feel like you just got screwed you can draw a line in the sand. If nothing comes from that, then maybe the judge is a reasonable person. And it will get thrown out. What I always tell my kids and what I try to remember is that you always have options. Again I now it's easy to say then do and I'm not involved, but you do have options. Good Luck BK

Damn Phil, you got screwed and they didn't even offer a reach around. You damn tootin I would sue the crap out of them. Wish you luck bud.

Thanks guys.

The more I think about it, the more pissed I get.

I stress- this was NOT my fault. I complied with everything the State told me to do, and early to boot.

Also, never so much as bene threatened with arrest in the past.

To repeat:

speeding ticket: January 29th or so of 2008

court date (I thought- I mixed up the dates owing to my FUBAR work schedule): 21MAR

ACTUAL court date: 12MAR

received letter from State: 24MAR
it said: pay by 31MAR, or we will suspend license.

I literally-- and I do mean this quite literally- jumped on the bike, cash in pocket, headed to the Courthouse/City Hall on the 24th when I received the letter, and paid on the 24th.

***** NOTE: This is 1 week ahead of the deadline. *****

There is no requirement to carry the receipt for 30 days. I carried the damn thing anyway, for near 90 days

***** NOTE: 90 days is longer than 30 days *****

Also note: I do not live in NY.

Quite frankly, the state fucked up.

Sorry to hear this BK. Possibly the clerk decided to pocket the cash and did not enter your payment into the system.

Negative.

I have the receipt. To get said receipt, the payment had to be put into the system.

I honestly can not think of any good excuse for why the state FUBARd this. But then, I am not a beaurocracy, and am thinking logically.

I see no doubt that they fucked up.

I think they should at least pay for your excess costs and lost time at work.

oh, don't doubt that they will.

I am in touch with a friend of a friend who's gone through nearly exactly the same situation. I say nearly exactly, in that the details aren't the same.

IE, he isn't me, different dates, etc. But he's a very stand-up guy, never gave anyone any trouble.
His lawyer took the case on a probono arrangement, and he recovered damages equal to his lawyer's fees, work time lost, towing and so on.

and by "and so on" I mean, "and a little extra to cover him for the trouble of going through all this crap".

Again, I am not trying to be a litigious asshole, but if we as law-abiding citizens don't stand up to this sort of bullshit, then the state has just discovered another revenue stream, not to mention the whole false arrest/false imprisonment aspect.

Don't let them take you to the cleaners, bk. Stand up for your rights. You are right in that you've been wronged. Give 'em hell, brother.

Ok Burner if they do a Rodney King on BK, at least you can front the bail money

And I'll carve him some new wooden teeth, free of charge.